Steven Kelly is one of the participants in Harry Pierson's latest podcast on model-driven development. Another of the participants is Bran Selic, whom Harry introduces as "Brian". I've known Bran for a long time, since we wrote the joint IBM/ObjecTime submission to UML 1 together, when I worked for IBM, which I had to persuade to take some interest in UML. It was a good proposal that we made together - it was a foundation for domain-specific languages; but it got beaten in the end by Rational's "3 amigos" submission. We did manage to crowbar OCL into it, though. Then Rational bought ObjecTime, and IBM bought Rational, so Bran now works for IBM, and has the unenviable job of cleaning up UML 2. Now Bran teases me with comments about "blue screens" and I respond with digs about "big blue". There you go.