W3C Charters Pointer Events Working Group


Following Microsoft’s submission of the Pointer Events specification, the W3C announced Friday the launch of the Pointer Events Working Group. The group intends to use Microsoft’s proposal, based on the APIs available today in IE10 on Windows 8, as the starting point for a Recommendation track specification, an important step towards interoperable support on the Web. In their announcement, the W3C said, “enabling content creators to use a single [pointer] model for different input types will make content creation more efficient and inclusive.”

Last week during the W3C’s annual Technical Plenary and Advisory Council (TPAC) meeting in Lyon, France, members of the W3C met informally to discuss Pointer Events. Present in the meeting were representatives of Google, Mozilla, Opera, Nokia, LG, Intel, Microsoft, and others. With the overwhelming support pointer events received from browser vendors and Web developers, consumers and developers benefit. We look forward to working together to bring the next generation of input to the interoperable Web through standards.

Jacob Rossi

Program Manager

Comments (10)

  1. Real McCoy says:

    I found inconsistencies with IE9/10 when using iframe based text-editors. For example, there are several online eCommerce solutions (such as; cscart) which uses this open-source EditArea library http://www.cdolivet.com/…/exemple_full.html. Today IE team updated the bug report as Fixed connect.microsoft.com/…/747092. I am using IE10 RTM (10.0.9200.16384/KB2718695) and I can still reproduce this issue so I have reopened it.

    I am a software engineer and analyzing the bug report like this one connect.microsoft.com/…/599657, given I don't have the code but in my estimation its a matter of ONE conditional statement in Find function. It would take me few minutes (less than 60 thats for sure!) to resolve this issue and document it, as opposed to waiting for 13 months to reply: "We were able to validate your feedback. However, based on the limited impact this bug may have, we will not be able to address this bug during this release". And therefore you are able to reproduce it in IE6, 7, 8, 9 and now 10 because Mr. busy-guy thinks it isn't important for him so its not important for rest of the world!

    All the non-IE browsers supports Ctrl+0 shortcut to zoom-to-normal. IE supports it if the zero is pressed on QWERTY keyboard. If its pressed on numpad, it doesn't follow connect.microsoft.com/…/708803. Similarly, all the tab-based browsers browser support Ctrl+browser_back, Ctrl+browser_forward shortcuts to open the corresponding page in a new tab. For example, I want to navigate to previous page without leaving the current page.. but IE team closed it as Won't Fix.

    Ever heard of "IE amnesia"? Check this out: connect.microsoft.com/…/735370. And IE team at Microsoft thinks it has "limited impact"!! People has literlly quit using IE for this very issue that IE forgets the user preferences as it doesn't store them actively in first place. The cache is fragile and get corrupted easily. This issue is there since the inception of IE.

    These are just few examples, hundreds of such scenarios can be found on Connect. Check this out the-dees.webs.com/iepp1. Now this guy has bust his ass off for IE team to compile a list of issues. Then he reported these issues separately on Connect. Naturally, most of the issues reported by him are closed with some unbelievable bogus argument… They clearly just don't care!

    I wonder, is Connect just for an eye-wash? How seriously does the IE team consider our bug reports? Waay more than half of the bug reports are closed as Won't Fixed, Non-Reproducible and By Design, while its easily replicated by many out there. Exactly who are the people replying to our bug reports? Are those the IE team members or some cheap customer support junkies who just copy-paste the text time-to-time to make it look like some activity is going on??

    Microsoft should fire those personnel who are responsible for fending off and discouraging people giving potential feedback.

  2. lll says:

    Really although he has heard that the release preview version which IE10 for Windows 7 will come out tomorrow?

    http://www.liveside.net/…/internet-explorer-10-for-windows-7-preview-coming-tomorrow

  3. Tony says:

    Hey all, can anyone confirm: among the Windows 8 tablets (windows.microsoft.com/…/all-pcs), which one is this: ads1.msn.com/…/skydrive-hero.jpg ? It looks slightly like "Lenovo Thinkpad Tablet 2", but its pretty sleek. Can anyone please tell if its a future model or the existing one? :)

    @IE-team, thanks alot for the heads up. Microsoft's touch model is great. I'm not surprised. Because Microsoft is always propose state-of-the-art solutions to W3C and C++ ISO… a deserving software giant. (at least better than most of the wannabes out there.. no offence!) 😎

  4. Snowknight26 says:

    Real McCoy, I agree with you entirely. It's abysmal really. Of the 43 bugs I've submitted, the breakdown is as follows:

    Won't fix – 16

    By Design – 6

    Fixed – 12

    Active – 3

    Not Reproducable – 6

    The numbers speak for themselves.

    The only strategy is to just keep reopening the unfixed bugs they closed. Maybe then they'll get the memo.

  5. Mike Dimmick says:

    @Real McCoy: Connect is for issues in *unreleased* versions of Internet Explorer. If you have a problem in a *released* version, that you need fixed before the next major release, you should open a case with Support.

    Even if the issue is fixed for you, the fix may not make it into a general release any time soon. IE updates are cumulative, but they have two tracks, a General Distribution Release and a Limited Distribution Release. Users only get the LDR files if they have themselves installed an LDR hotfix; security updates and important updates update whichever track the computer is already on.

    A very small number of product teams do take bug reports for released products through Connect, targeting their next cumulative update. I believe SQL Server do this. It's very uncommon though.

    I would also suggest that you need to break down your bug reports into far smaller simple reproducible cases. Don't roll up lots of issues into one report, as you have done with your first case.

    As a software engineer, you should also understand that stabilization is very important. It's far better to ship with minor issues in place than to introduce a higher-impact bug when trying to fix the minor issue. It's been clear that IE 10 has been in stabilization mode pretty much since the developer preview of Windows 8 – a requirement due to the IE engine's use for HTML+JS apps in Windows 8, they didn't want to make the same mistake as "Longhorn" where .NET and the "WinFX" components were constantly under development, preventing apps from being stabilized.

    Stabilization is the reason for separating the LDR track out – if there is a fault in one of the hotfixes on that track, not detected in the limited amount of testing it is reasonable to do for one customer, it will affect far fewer people than if distributed to all customers. That does mean that if you find a fault that affects your public website, getting the fix for it distributed out to your customers is ridiculously hard. You'll have to work around it.

  6. Real McCoy says:

    @Mike Dimmick, how about you take a look at this issue: connect.microsoft.com/…/support-dom-level-3-xpath

    Now try the test-case mentioned in the description (http://www.freewebs.com/…/205-dom-level-3-xpath.html) on IE10 release preview in Windows 7 and IE10 RTM on Windows 8 (both latest versions till date).

    Clicking on document.implementation.hasFeature('xpath', '3.0') button would return "false"

    Try it on Firefox, it would return "true".

    Now, read the last comment by Microsoft. Do you honestly think they made a "mistake" OR they deliberately lied? In my previous post, I mentioned another bug-report which was "mistakenly?" closed as Fixed and they "mistakenly?" replied that "This issue was resolved in Internet Explorer 10 released on 10/26/2012."

    Either very incompetent people are managing bug-reports (copy/pasting text) or they are just staging a drama "we are actually listening to you!"

    The Visual Studio team OTOH, carefully read the bug report and carefully reply to the people. Every reply varies from one another. No copy/paste and no time-waste. Honesty! just honesty! is it too much to ask from IE team?

  7. mahara says:

    > From: Real McCoy

    > Now, read the last comment by Microsoft. Do you honestly think they made a "mistake" OR they deliberately lied?

    > Either very incompetent people are managing bug-reports (copy/pasting text) or they are just staging a drama "we are actually listening to you!"

    > The Visual Studio team OTOH, carefully read the bug report and carefully reply to the people. Every reply varies from one another. No copy/paste and no time-waste. Honesty! just honesty! is it too much to ask from IE team?

    Right on. I can sense that too.

    If IE team were not serious and/or vague about using Connect, perhaps they SHOULDN'T use it all.

    It's just wasting time for both parties: MS and issue reporters.

    The key point here, as Real McCoy pointed above, is about honesty.

    Why did IE team have to LIE, when they DIDN'T actually CARE about it?

    I'd rather to hear a frank and straightforward response like, "Sorry, we don't care about it!", than to hear "We actually care about it, but …".

    I don't really like the "but" part. The "but" part usually ends up, "Unfortunately, we are currently unable to address your feedback. We will consider fixing this issue in the future." WTF is that?

    If they weren't being honest, then what's left?

    And I couldn't agree more about VS team. VS team is probably the best team in Connect I've ever interacted with.

    They're pretty much being honest and straightforward in their responses. If they said they will fix it, they actually fixed it (means it can be verified and CONSISTENT to what they said). And if they won't, they'd say it as well, usually with detailed (technical) reasons on WHY it couldn't make it.

    They seems to be caring. Isn't it nice to see such attitude?

    Perhaps Connect should hold a contest through questionnaire to evaluate how well MS teams in Connect treat their customer issues.

    Duh… :(

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  9. LJ says:

    @Joe B.

    Interestingly, my results are completely different to yours (I have made a jsfiddle with your function and an additional corrected function that actually changes .top and .left as I assume you meant: http://jsfiddle.net/xUtcZ/1/).

    IE10:

    Test 1: 597ms

    Test 2: 2430ms

    FF17:

    Test 1: 1025ms

    Test 2: 4403ms

  10. LJ says:

    Okay – blame the awful comment section for this going under the wrong article.